Intermittent Electronic Throttle Control (ETC) Safety Mode While Driving
2003 Lincoln LS
We have all been dealing with gasoline engine ignition misfires since we’ve began working as technicians. There are many different diagnostic approaches that we can use to diagnose a misfire(s). You choose your diagnostic approach depending on the situation. Is the misfire at idle and/or under load? Is the misfire hard or light? Is it on one or multiple cylinders? Is it even an ignition misfire, or is it fuel or compression related? Once you get the feel of the misfire, you need to know what ignition system you have in order to continue your diagnostic path. You may have a conventional system, HEI, wasted spark, coil on plug, etc. Now from here you decide how you are going to find the misfire depending on type of misfire, the ignition system the vehicle has, and the diagnostic tools you have.
Why does the customer want the misfire fixed? Most likely it is the common symptoms misfires cause such as: low power, poor fuel economy, check engine light, shake, poor performance, shifting concerns, and all of the other ignition misfire symptoms we are use to. One thing that I have been learning recently, is that there are new symptoms caused by ignition misfires. The vehicles I have been seeing most of them on is the Lincoln LS. The Lincoln LS is equipped with COP (coil on plug) ignition system. I am sure most of us have seen or heard about the high failure rate of this style coil on Ford vehicles. Some of the new symptoms I have seen on this vehicle are stalling, false codes, loss of scan tool communication, unnecessary rev limiter activation, and a key off sensation while driving.
2000 Lincoln LS Firing Order – example
This case study is on a 2003 Lincoln LS with a 3.9 liter. This car came to me with the complaint ETC (electronic throttle control) warning displayed on the instrument cluster display upon cold start up occasionally and intermittent loss of power during hard acceleration while passing. Both symptoms had been occurring more and more frequently so it was brought to me at Dewitz Truck and Auto Repair, LLC.
The first thing I did was scan all of the vehicle’s modules for trouble codes. The only trouble code present was in the PCM which was a P1270, rev limit reached. This code will set whenever the rev limiter is activated. I then went through the PCM data PIDs and didn’t find anything that was out of line, so my next step was a test drive. Being located outside of Eau Claire, Wisconsin, we have plenty of open un-congested roads that are perfect for test drives. I made multiple hard accelerations and ¾ to full throttle acceleration while cruising. I could only duplicate the customer’s complaint during a ¾ to full throttle acceleration with a downshift and at any speed. When I went into a hard throttle while cruising, the vehicle would downshift and during the downshift I would experience a couple of different symptoms. These symptoms would happen every couple of times I would try to get them to occur. The symptom that occurred most of the time was unnecessary rev limiter activation. The rev limiter would activate between 3000 RPM and 5000 RPM during the downshift, and last a couple of seconds before continuing the downshift and accelerating like it should. During this event it would also set the P1270 code. The other symptom that would occasionally occur felt like the key was turned off a couple of seconds and then suddenly turned back on. This would occur during the same conditions as the rev limiter activation.
I graphed multiple scan data PIDs during the event such as VSS, gear position, RPM, TPS, wheel speed sensors, transmission input and output RPM, and every other PID that may or may not have had something to do with these symptoms. Nothing stood out. I drove the Lincoln in 4th instead of 5th and with the ABS and traction control inactive to try and rule out possible causes. For faster data capture, I scoped the digital transmission range position sensor, crank and cam sensors, and throttle position sensors. I was looking for any clues that could help me find the source of the problem. After many test drives I was leaning towards a transmission protection issue, but I thought there would have to be a transmission code set if the PCM was trying to protect the transmission. I didn’t know where to turn until something got me thinking differently.
During the last few test drives, I experienced the issues during a full throttle acceleration from a dead stop; which never happened before. Also, the LS went into ETC safety mode with an idle only condition twice. When this happened it set a P2112 (throttle actuator control system – stuck closed) and a P2104 (throttle actuator control system – forced idle). Now how do these three codes and symptoms all relate with each other?
I already checked for the common bad coil issue. I check the COP ignition systems for bad coils by back probing the main coil power feed with my scope on glitch capture and using an injector as my cylinder reference. I will do what I can to try to find a bad coil. This includes idle, cold, hot, snap throttle and/or power brake. I look for a positive or negative voltage spike on the coil ignition feed which will indicate the failing coil(s). This car passed this test with absolutely no problems. I also never felt a single misfire while driving this vehicle. After much contemplating, I came up with a theory. I know these Lincoln LS’ often stall because of a voltage spike from a bad coil to the PCM. I got out my extra long test leads and went for a test drive. During the event I caught an ignition voltage spike. I compiled some more data on this problem and could see that right after the spike I would always lose the injectors and sometimes even lose ignition primary. I also wanted to check my electronic throttle control issue. With my scope hooked up to ignition primary (glitch capture), and both throttle position signals (one on glitch capture), I captured the voltage spike on the TPS signal. The voltage spike is what cause the ETC codes and my other two problems.
What I think was happening is the coil would only fail under very high load and when it would fail, the voltage spike was always big enough to knock the PCM down. If the spike was smaller there would have been misfire complaints and P0300 codes instead of all the issues this one had. All of these issues make sense now, but sometimes you get pulled in and down the wrong road and you need to know when to turn back.
Leave any questions or comments below. Thank you.
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Great guide for Snap-On Modis, Versus, and Vantage Pro users but the manual is designed for all automotive scopes in mind. This great resource includes useful charts and tables, scope waveforms, graphing scan tool testing tips and tricks, along with scope test lead and low amp probe test hook up location diagrams. Sensor tests include O2, TPS, VSS, MAF, CKP, CMP and MAP. Other component testing includes fuel pumps, coils, starters, blower motors, and fuel injectors. Ford Mode 6 misfire diagnostics and Ford coil on plug (COP) testing tricks included. Tricks include two test lead hook-ups to diagnose how many coils and which cylinder coils are bad, even before the customer knows! Download Now – $15
Shannon
What fixed it? I have the same problem.
Travis Dewitz
What I think was happening is the coil would only fail under very high load and when it would fail, the voltage spike was always big enough to knock the PCM down.
octavia
Hey I have a 2001 Lincoln ls and i am trying to see if having a bad coil will cause the car to shake and act like it don’t want to pick up speed ?
tracy
I changed my plug today and coil # 8cuz the computer said #8had the misfire and now that what my cat is doing really bad skipping when I give it gas it want to shut off it seems I don’t know what’s causing t.hat but would luv to know so it can be fixed
Luke
Mk I’m having the same issue with my Lincoln LS multiple misfire with new coils and new plugs only thing I haven’t checked is the PCM and the radio capacitor do you have any idea what could be causing the misfire no vacuum leaks nothing
benjamin mctoy
I have a 2003 Lincoln ls 3.9v8 when I drive on take off it shifts and I get a kick and then it shift fine after that what could this be a abs sensor or a transmission speed sensor
Travis Dewitz
That sounds like something other than a speed sensor. Would have to personally feel it and look at data before even starting to think of a solution.
JR.
Hey brutha, I don’t really know too much about cars and all that mumbo jumbo in the article. lol. I do have a lincoln LS that seems like it as a rev limiter on it as it won’t rev very high in park. Is this normal?
Adrian
So if its the coils what kind of coils would you recommend for it then? mines does a sputter at idle and when it hits around 40 mph.
Travis Dewitz
I almost always put Motorcraft coil in myself.
Roscoe
What was your problem?
Bob Spidell
My folks had these exact problems with his 2000 LS. They were losing confidence in the car, which they otherwise loved. After replacing cam and crank sensors–other possible causes of similar symptoms–we finally replaced all 8 coils and plugs (coils were from Napa). Since then, the car has run perfectly.
Thanks, Travis!
Billy
We are having the same problem, the dealer replaced one coil last year and the problem stopped now its back. The dealer don’t seam to know anything and its costing more and more money every time we take it in, can u help us also?
Travis Dewitz
Sounds like another coil is failing. Your car has 8 individual coils and when one fails it is common for the rest to fail withing a couple years or less.
Dave
Go buy set of coils on line cost you way less than dealer replace all of them ,is no use replace them individually ,problem will happen under load and may not happen all the time
Dan
I have a couple of questions. 1 whats the deal with three cadillacic converters on my 3.9 does that have any infuence on my coils and back pressure?? 2 How tough is it to change the spark plugs in this pig?? 3 If i would drive my LS to you guys would u make her happy. car will be in michigan in spring time?? Thanks for ur time
Dan Moormann
Travis Dewitz
Your car probably has pre cats which is why you have three. The exhaust system has no effect on your coils and will test out at 0psi back pressure. Changing some of the plugs can be a chore but we do them all the time. We will work on anything you bring us. Travis
Max
I have a 2004 LS V8 that went into ETC failsafe with the same codes you were having. The only catch is that it is in ETC failsafe now everytime I turn the key on and it will turnover but won’t start. The throttle drives closed and stays whenever the key is turned on and them the cooling fan goes full blast and drains my battery pretty quickly while I’m getting the codes. My question is, how do I get out of ETC failsafe? Also, can I test the TPS? A full set of motor craft coils are on the way but I’m not sure how I’m going to get it to even start?
Travis Dewitz
Sounds like you have other issue. Do you have spark, fuel pressure, injector pulse? Battery also should not die so quickly. I test electronic throttles with a scope and or scan tool. Do TPS 1 and 2 agree? How did the car run before it quit starting?
Joseph
So what was the result
Max
I have spark and fuel pressure but I don’t know how to test for injector pulse, I have a scanner that does live PID and I have a multimeter. I installed a new battery to take that out of the loop. As far as TPS 1 and 2, not sure, the PID data shows the “relative throttle” at 0 degrees when the throttle plate is closed. Before the current problem, the car would start with rough idle about once a month and a few hours before the ETC it would hesitate on acceleration as if the ignition was shutoff.
Travis Dewitz
I have a feeling you have something else going on if it doesn’t start. Theft, PCM, wiring, plugged exhaust, flooded, MAF, engine mechanical timing?
del kincaid
i just bought 2003 ls its having the same problem but mine did start i hit the reset for the fuel and it ran but the next morring it didnt its fuel related problem take to the dealer and let them fix it. failsafe engine, and fuel comperter data err is on lol
tynekia
Im havin this same problem car will not start when it cold outside…replace ect sensor and crank sensor also new battery….but if u reset the chk engine light and its warm outside car runs find but when it gets cold check engine light comes on also etc safe fail and car cranks over until cooling fan cuts off than fuel pump cuts on and car cranks up…..its has like seven codes most are throttle and one is fuel control out and other is pcm damage..fault all others is throttle
Travis Dewitz
Most PCM internal fault codes are pretty good at telling you that you have a bad PCM. Try bringing the PCM inside over night and see if the car starts the next day.
tracy shumate
Just bought an 05 ls was driving fine and went to put it in drive and it stall engine and lunges forward like torque converter is locked up
anthony
anthony its sputting and loss of power could it b more then jus coils gor 8 new coils but are dualast…
Tim
I bought a 2000 LS 3.9L and i love it but ive had so many problems with it but this is the worst. ive only had it for 3 years and i dont drive it often because im in the army. but about a year ago it started misfiring, it wasn’t bad at first until recently i came home for Christmas and it was extremely horrible. the misfire happens and it shakes the whole car during idle and when im driving. it almost seems like its going to stall out. and it feels like its in multiple cylinders. when i accelerate hard it misfires real bad and feels like it wont shift. my fuel mileage is also saying i get 5 mpg. i burned a half tank doing a 30 minute drive on the highway. i was told that it could be the coils and what im reading it just might be, but what do you think Travis?
Tim Shank – Michigan
Travis Dewitz
It could be ignition coils which is a common failure on that engine. But it could be a lot of other things. I think some trustworthy testing is in order.
Jabre
I had the same issue the gasket seals on the ls suck so if you pull your plugs I bet they’re drenched in oil or water… Replace the seals and your now gunna have to replace coils and plugs that should fix it.. That did it for me.. The car drives great when running properly . I’ve had mine (05 v8) for about four years and I swear man problem after problem. Too many dam computers.
Javier
Did You figure out what it was? I have the same promblem and it would not accelerate after like an 1 hour drive, I was wondering in getting the coils checked.
Walter porras
Talking about coil issues, what about the type of gas you are using? Can the type of gas be a coil killer? Thanks.
Travis Dewitz
These coils are failing electrically and gas is not an issue. Fuel can cause misfires and combustion issues though.
Walter porras
I recently replace 6 defective coils with Motorcraft ones. Now, the misfire appeared in one of the New Motorcraft coils. Do i have to replace them all again? 2 of the coils still the original ones. Misfire is not present in old coils. Suggestions??
Travis Dewitz
I have not seen too many bad new Motorcraft coils but it does happen. The misfire could also be fuel, compression, or spark plug related. You only need to repair the problem on not all of the coils.
walter porras
Thank you Mr. Dewitz. While solving the problem, I found that these type of vehicles came with defective valve cover gaskets and ignition coils from factory. This condition leaks oil into the coils creating misfires as well. Ford co. has a program that replaces these parts if your VIN number applies to it. However they charge $150 for the computer test, and they do not guarantee the replacement of all coils if condition does not show on their computers. I’m afraid of taking my vehicle to the dealer (very expensive previous experiences). Can oil really kill coils or can they just be cleaned and reinstalled? Thanks…
Travis Dewitz
The oil may swell or affect the rubber coil boots but should not effect the coils in anyway that I know of. Also, oil does not conduct electricity.
Kevin Kellerman
Partially true… clean oil doesn’t conduct, but motor oil with carbon and normal wear particles will when you hit it with 50kv from one of these systems.
I had a 2000ls and I have a 06 la with 191k on her. The valve seal issue was solved in 2003, late 2002. You have to pull the valve cover, replace tgat and the donut seals in the plug wells, I know, I did it. Solved the problem. My 06 has been pretty bomb proof aside from some dumb stuff like a cooling system plastic component failures, including the radiator tank and overflow bottle.
I have changed plugs 3 times and coils once since I got the car with 21k on it originally. Honestly I wish they still made it, I’d buy another one in a heartbeat.
mick neil
Is this basically the same as the 2003 v6 model. I ive been having problems with the vehicle hesitating and backfiring in the intake under light acceleration. I’ve changed my coils twice in one year.
Travis Dewitz
I believe it is.
Walter Porras
I replaced all the coils for Motorcraft ones as suggested. The vehicle ran OK for a few weeks but now I have a P0335, P0303, P0304. I replaced the coils again on cylinders 3, 4 and 5. The problem persists. Suggestions??
By the way, If the coil fails under heavy loads does it mean that the coils will have to be replace when this happens?? How can I fix this issue permanently??
Thanks…
Travis Dewitz
I assume you have replaced the plugs with OE ones? P0335 is a crank code. Severe miss could cause it or a crank sensor could cause the misfire. You still have other things like injectors, fuel system, and compression that needs to be checked. A real diagnosis may require good testing.
Chris Sears
2005 Lincoln LS 3.9 V8. I have had the dreaded COP issue with it over the last year. I changed out all plugs about 3 months ago and had changed out 6 of the 8 coils within the last 6 months. It recently went to missing again. It got extremely bad to the point to only going about 35 mph. So yesterday used an actron code reader to get the codes, number 8 cylinder miss (replaced it), cleared then drove. New code cylinder 7 misfire. When I pulled this coil out it was smoking and had white powder looking stuff all over the boot and smelled burnt to a crisp (replaced coil and cleared code). Still missed and only runs half throttle even putting pedal to the floor. Today replaced all plugs and the last two original coils. Now all 8 new plugs and new coils withing the last 6 months (checked all coils no more looked bad or smelled like the one burnt). Cleaned throttle body also. Car isn’t missing but still runs half throttle and sounds like a four barrel when stomping the accelerator down. Any help??????
Travis Dewitz
Fuel pressure and volume, mass airflow calculation, restricted exhaust, or electronic throttle issues could all be suspected. Needs to be tested and verified.
MEAGAN
Same type of problems. I took to mechanic said misfire so I changed all 8 coil n plug at the same time, an I got the right ones! It’s getting fuel an no problem with pump. Car will not start at all, will turn over but no fire. Can u help me please?
Travis Dewitz
I would need much more info. Sounds like a possible theft issue?
Waleed
Please Help! My lincoln ls 2004 v8 have random misfire. I got these codes p0353 p0356 p0357 p0358 i change the following: the battery , all coils , all plugs , o2 front sensors , DCCV , clean tha MAF , the fuel rail pressure sensor and air filter and thermostat and it still misfire and rough in idle and at load. Please help me because i have now cylinders no. 3 and 6 no negative puls from the pcm and the power balance test show me a strange spiky graph. The mechanic said it may be from the pcm. One more thing that the AC is not working!
Travis Dewitz
I wish I could help but hands on testing would be the only way with such a complex problem. What are your fuel trims, cylinder static and running compression, fuel injector drop test results?
Waleed
Is this can be done by a regular scan tool ?
I have something strang today that when i conduct a KOER test during that test the ignition was perfect but as soon this test over the rough engine come back again why is this happening , also in the live data I recognise that EGR status faild and fuel system status OL fault and pop up with two more codes p0108 and P0406 ! Any idea please.
Travis Dewitz
Possibly you may have an EGR valve sticking open?
Waleed
That means when testing the vehicle with KOER the EGR valve open and when the test done it stocked again ?
Travis Dewitz
The EGR does operate during this test but you need to do some hands on testing to verify the issue.
Waleed
What is the best scan tools and PCM programming tools for this vehicle ?
Travis Dewitz
Ford’s IDS is the best tool for the job.
shawn
did u ever get a fix to this problem…im having the same issue and same codes p0353 p0356 p0357 p0358. im pulling my hair out…fuel trims are all 0, fuel pressure is ok, compression is good. egr is not the issue.
Travis Dewitz
Did you read the post? The problem, data, and fix are there 🙂
matt villemure
03 Lincoln LS. goes to closed throttle at times. happens with speed contol on or off. if on cruise the cruise light turns off and you have to turn the cruise switch back on.if it happens without cruise on and you keep the same throttle position the car will just keep slowing down from 50 to 30. if at the moment the event occures you open and close the throttle the engine responds immediately. suspect coils. put 4 new motorcraft coils on right bank. no help. put the 4 I took out of the right and put on the left. no help. tried to induce concern by pulling a random coil out of plug hole and drivining car in this high stress mode. guess what. the engine misses but my going to closed throttle problem wont occur. so I also tried it with one of the coils just disconnected. same thing misses but no throttle closings. hooked everything back up problems back.this event will occur 3-4 times at steady cruise in 5-6 miles
no body has a clue why the concern goes away if I induce a misfire.
matt villemure
I forgot to say. there are no drive codes. the ETC failsafe light does not come on.
Travis Dewitz
What are you checking codes with?
Jason
What is the fix for that voltage spike and what is causing it?
Travis Dewitz
I think the post thoroughly goes over the procedure and fix for this issue. The coil fails internally and secondary voltage gets into the primary circuit of the coil. Finding the coil and replacing it, is the fix.
Betty
My Lincoln Ls-V6 is giving me some of the same problems. I had the car diagnoised at a Ford dealer; it showed that the Cat-converers, & sensors were bad. I just had them replaced. The car is now going into fail-safe mode, along with engine misfire. What would you suggest may be the problem?
Travis Dewitz
Sounds like you have a misfire that needs to be addressed first. Ignition related misfires will damage your convertors as well. If you just had convertors put in they should be under warranty and it should be noted that universal convertors rarely hold up in my experience.
Betty
Thanks for our prompt reply! I took the car took be checked again it showed the following: P0054-02 Sensor-Bank1 Sensor 2; P0301-Cylinder 1 misfire; P0316 Misfire on startup; P0442 Small emission system leak; P2104-Throttle Activator Content System forced idle; P2107- Throttle Activator
contend module
Travis Dewitz
The only code and concern you need to worry about at this time is the p0310 and the misfire. The rest of the codes are not driveability issues at this time.
Doug
i was wondering, i have been reviewing your book and articles and am needing some clarification. i see from the shots above were you measuring voltage or amps on yellow trace, i am just a little confused on how you were able to measure voltage primary with one lead how were you able to get a wave in firing order from other cylinders. or were you measuring amperage? trying to build my knowledge and just need pieces of puzzle filled in.
Travis Dewitz
The yellow trace on the first waveform on this page is from a low amp probe. When I do my COP testing I put Ch. 1 on peak detect on the primary power feed which will pick up a similar waveform but with much less resolution but the ability to see the voltage spikes that indicate the failing coils.
Doug
Iv always wanted to test primary ignition with factory test leads but was told it would fry my vantage pro and haven’t tried it, have you had success with all cop or dis systems or just ford, how could I be sure so I don’t smoke my scope
Doug
So have you been show to test primary ignition with plain leads on most cars or on just fords I have wanted to try it but was told it would blow my vantage pro
Travis Dewitz
I am sure it would work on some other models but Fords have the multi strike system which helps me diagnose the faulty coils and their coils also have issues of secondary bleeding into primary which not all calls do when failing.
Travis Dewitz
Fords are the only ones that I have experience with the coil failures being hard to diagnose at times. You do have to be careful if you have huge voltage spikes bleeding over. I have had a a couple large spikes lock up the scope where I had to do a power down. Some of those large spikes also shutdown the vehicles PCM.
jermaine gammon
my lincoln ls is also acting up. two mechanics told me its the throttle actuactor control system but im reading some of these and im not sure what to do. help me. my car starts up and cuts right off. also when it does run it runs rough.
Travis Dewitz
Without being able to scan and scope it, it is next to impossible to tell you what is wrong with a problem like you have 🙁
jermaine gammon
Yes but both mechanics read the code and said it was something with the throttle control. But all 11 codes came up. So im nor sure if i should replace that or maybe one of the coils. Its runs like crap. How much is a throttle assembly and can i install it myself. Do i need to reprogram anything?
Travis Dewitz
Prices vary on brands and location. If your good with cars you could probably do it yourself. Most likely may need to be programmed. Not 100%. In the end it needs to be tested by a tech that digs deeper than just reading codes.
Joe
The problem that I have been having is slow throttle response it takes a couple of seconds of rev up and when you take it for a test drive it will not rev up past 3000 rpm and it will not shift and if you hold the peddle past quater throttle it sounds like a old school 4 barrel carb opening but it will not rev up past 3000 rpm and it sounds like pre detonation ping
jonathan
I have a 2003 lincoln ls v6 I was driving one day went to take off and lost all power it won’t go over 5mph and runs like crap when it sits at a idle it runs like crap and I smell gas changed the spark pkugs changed egr valve changed throttle position sensor still nothing amd running like crap if anybody can help me please do my email is wakeland10125@gmail.com
Serge
I have a 2000 Lincoln LS with some severe electrical problems, loses energy and shuts down, as if the battery will discharge, I recently changed one of the eight coils. When start the engine, it works for a few seconds and then go off, the control panel goes crazy and disappears temporarily screen information. additionally cruise control system does not work anymore.
Any Suggestion?
Thanks!
Travis Dewitz
You may have a communication problem or maybe a main ground or power issue. First step would to pull codes from all the modules to help narrow the issue down.
dave
I had one 2003 ls with tps code and replace tps same problem, replace all 8 coils resolve the problem, it was never mentioned in any repair manual took me 1 month to figure it out
Mark Carranza
I ran across a similar problem with a 2001 Nissan Pathfinder. The PCM was setting a P1320 LOSS OF IGNITION SIGNAL. The vehicle had been to 3 other shops, and no-one could figure it out. Even Direct Hit suggested replacing all 6 coils with factory parts. At over $170 a coil, the customer bulked at that idea. Let me scope it, I said. Using jumpers from the IGN relay and a low amp probe, and using #1 coil power wire, I was able to scope all 6 coils. #3 and #5 coil was showing excessive amperage. And since the coils have a transistor built into them, it sends a signal back to the PCM, letting it know that the coil,is indeed firing. The 2 coils were pulling over 10 amps, while the rest were at 6-7 amps. We changed #5, retested and now only #3 was pulling too many amps. Replaced #5, and everything was in perfect order. Before replacing the coils, the CHK ENG. light would common almost immediately, like a HARD FAULT. We test drove for a day, and CHK ENG light never came back on.
Customer was amazed that after all the chasing around other shops have done, I was able to fix it. Needless to say, we have a dedicated customer for all his car needs.
It just goes to show how powerful a scope can be when you have someone in your shop that can actually use one.
Angel
I have a 02 la and it shuts off if I’m at a red light for too long. Would that be the coils too? Mechanic said it was the air intake. Had it replaced but still doing it.
Travis Dewitz
Any codes? Maybe it is overheating and shutting down? You can’t use a Ford vehicles temp gauge as an indicator of actual engine temp. Their gauges are fake and really just a fancy dummy light. Need more information I guess.
DAVE ROST
I HAD 2 2003 LINCOLN LS SAME PROBLEM THE COIL FAIL AT LOAD WILL EFFECT THE COMPUTER IT WILL NOT ACCELERATE,, SOUND LIKE FAIL SAFE MODE, WHAT WAS ONE COIL WILL SHORT AND CAUSE COMPUTER ACT FUNNY, AND THERE IS NO CODE FOR DEFECTIVE COIL, DO NOT WAIST TIME , JUST REPLACE ALL THE COILS , AND GET IT OVER WITH
Flint
I’ve been having this problem intermittently for the past 14 months. I’m going to replace the plugs and coils since this is a common issue. Thank you for posting this Travis!
greg
wow, did you expect all these questions when you started this topic? i probably dont need to explain why im here. same problems on a 2000 ls. random misfire code. ordered new coils today. when i recently removed my coils and plugs to inspect them, i noticed that the piece that looks like a spring inside the boot of the coils doesnt really fit snug on the spark plugs. if i were to put a plug in one of them and try to let it hang from the coil,,it would probably just fall out. my car isnt misfiring really bad, but its definitely noticeable and is lacking some power. thanks for all the info you have shared, its been very helpful.
Travis Dewitz
That is normal. The spring doesn’t snap to the plug but it does to the coil.
Krista
I just had 3 coils replaced bringing the total to 5 within the last year. This time after replacement, the car will bog down intermittently while taking off, it will barely move. It still stutters at about 40 mph also. The check engine light is not coming on and no code is coming up. What could be going on?
Travis Dewitz
So many things can cause those symptoms. I would need some data like fuel trims.
Johnny
Travis,
I was wondering if you remember if when the LS threw the Fail Safe Mode, where you able to rev the engine? If so, what was it limited to and where did it idle at? Thanks a lot!
Travis Dewitz
In failsafe mode you have very little to no throttle response.
Johnny
Ah I see Thanks!
Zach C
I have a 2004 Lincoln LS. It keeps having “ETC engine failsafe mode” issue. It started doing it once a month or so and now it does it about 30 seconds after start up. It shuts the engine down as soon as it appears on the dash. When it first started having issues, the temp guage would spike high really quick then come right back to normal. I’ve opened hood and didn’t seem to be hotter than normal. I have cleaned throttle body, replaces TPS, checked alternator, new battery, looked at cop and have not noticed anything leaking into them or the plugs. Also I have checked throttle position to foot pedal position and it seems to be right on. I reset codes and after starting it again I get code:
P0606 – PCM processor Fault
P1235 – Manfacture control fuel air metering
P2106 – TAC system forced limited power
P2107 – TAC module processor
P2135 – TPS/pedal position sensor/switch A/B voltage
correlation
P0102 – MAF or VAF A circuit low input
Zach C
Travis, what are your thoughts on this?
Travis Dewitz
Needs to be tested by a good tech. Looks like you have a difficult to capture event. I would really look into the coils and pedal to throttle signals.
christian
my 2003 Lincoln LS 3.9 is having issues with idle has a little misfire or something but has new plugs in it and when driving it will not take off good only slow and if I get on the gas little harder it just sounds like its starving of gas or something and check engine light is on I checked it and it said that cam position sensor 1 and sensor 2 we re bad or something like that I don’t remember exactly you think just replacing the sensors will fix that that’s the only 2 codes I get nothing else
Travis Dewitz
Needs to be tested. Almost sounds like the timing is off. I don’t think cam sensors will fix your problem, but would need to test first.
Zach C
Travis, what are your thoughts on this?
daniel
Hi after a long battle with this problem car. I now have turn to the net for help. History of car 03 ls v6 new plugs and COP all motorcraft. when very cold 40 deg or lower no start has spark, fuel pump stays at 30lbs but never rise key on it goes into ECT imeditly when in ECT it will not start, fans are running no injector pulse . Clear codes with IDS turn key on 7 codes pop back all throttle body and lean codes fuel pump codes. Crank engine no start. When you hear the fans go off than it will run all day until it drops below 40 and it starts all over. All grounds good and power feed good with no voltage drop. I have come to the conclusion that the PCM is bad that it has a crack in the board and when it is cold it opens and when warm it closes. This make no sense that all the code come back with the KOEO I thick i will put a little heater up by the pcm to keep it warm all night and see what happens but i know it will start.
Travis Dewitz
1/2 way through this I was thinking PCM and was going to tell you the same. Get the car cold to the point of a no start, pull pcm, warm it up and see what happens. Or on a warm car, pull PCM and put it in the freezer.
daniel
well i did just that and toke a littler heater and put it up by the pcm inside the car and warmed the case maybe 30 seconds kinda hot and it fired right up so i am pretty convinced at this point it is the pcm $536 from the dealer
Patrick
I have a 2003 Lincoln ls 3.0
I just replaced the motor and now getting multiple observed codes for the transmission. Po755 po743 po760 po132 po750 po966 p2196. Before replacing the motor there was no transmission codes. The car has no power and doesn’t want to go. My mechanic says a brand new transmission will fix the problem but I guess my question is does this sound right that I need a new transmission? Can anyone tell me if you had the same problem as me and figured out what is going on with theses cars ??
Travis Dewitz
Sounds like a power or ground issue. They need to use logic, testing, and some wire diagrams to confirm the issue before changing a transmission.
Alex
I have a 01 lincoln ls v8. It shakes at idle(whole car shakes) runs perfect otherwise. CEL comes on after couple of days and then goes away by itself. It comes up with cyl 3 or 4 misfire. My guess is it only misfires at idle. It have new fuel pump new cops new catalytic converter. I showed it to couple of mechanics they cannot figure out the problem. It is so annoying. Do you have any idea what the problem can be? I will really appreciate any help.
Travis Dewitz
Would need to do some testing or see the results of some tests.
Billy
I have a 2001 Lincoln LS with the 3.9L V-8 engine. The vehicle ran out of gas. The car started after adding fuel. After start-up, the engine was misfiring and unable to achieve 35 mph. I took it to the local dealer and was notified that the #4 cylinder has no compression. There only solutions were a new motor or salvage yard. This seems odd and have been to three shops with the same answer. Any ideas will be appreciated.
Travis Dewitz
If a compression test reads zero psi, what does the leakdown test say? Rings, piston, head gasket, or valves?
Billy
Thank you for the quick response. Your recommendation, finally, got me answers from a technician. The issue can be resolved but will require hours of tear down. 15-20hrs just getting to the cylinder. That translated into more money than an engine swap.
Art
I have an ’03 LS 3.9 . My problem is I have no throttle response in park or neutral but in any drive gears it seems to work fine. There are no codes being thrown but it seems that I have to push pedal farther than normal for car to begin moving.WOT response is immediate.
Trevor
Hello we are having problems with our 2000 Lincoln ls 3.9 car will start fine idle fine as u out the car in neutral u can’t rev the car over 3000 grand it hits rev limiter if you put the car in drive it does the same thing it hits 3 grand and starts hitting rev limiter or if you try to kick it to a passing gear it hits rev limiter please help
Trevor
Put the car in neutral not out the car I hate spell check lol
chuck
my fuel sensor that is connected on the fuel rail is bad would it make my car cut out sometimes and run in e.t.c safe mode I need help figuring this out thank you
Jesus Andrade
Hi my names jesus I have a similar problem but with 03 Dodge ram 4.7 magnm I just put the motor in the old one gave out. Now when im just driving normal it has no problems at all but when I press the gas all the way down it will stop at 3rpn at like 30mph and than I let go the gas and do it again and it will stop again at 3rpms at 40mph seems like it wont go into gears right. Do I have to have it programmed since its different engine?
Nick
I have a 1998 Lincoln TC and while I”m driving first my radio will shut off and then the dash board and then the car. If I keep the car moving it will stay alive but as soon as I start stopping after about 15 mins of driving it that happens. I’ve replaced the battery, had the alternator checked and replaced the crankshaft sensor. Is there any other Idea that you can think of to help me out.
Erica
Hello, my name is Erica and you sound like you know what youre talking about, however, i could really use a much less vocabularized in mechanics speak answer to a pretty bothersome problem that i have been having with my 2000 lincoln ls. In other words….could you please just give me a direct solution on how to fix this problem in terms easy enough for a “girl” to understand and be able to do, if that’s even possible. Lol. I know some about working on vehicles and have been under a hood almost my entire life but no schooling on the topic and little known mechanical vocabulary with a bad short term memory to boot. Lol. But i have a 2000 Lincoln LS with a 3.9 liter engine in it and it is inconsistently having a mis fire in no. 6, which almost always Only when it’s under a load yet a few times its happened while at idle. It just feels like the car is going to die all together sometimes when starting out forward from an idle position as well but it never does. It will then just drive as great as.if it had just come out of the factory and hit the.road for its first ever drive. What’s the problem here and before you say coil pack they have all just been newly replaced when the problem first started a few months ago. Those are brand new coil packs. So how do i fix this please!!!!!
Carter
I have a 2002 LS with a sensor 2 failure. The car is jumping when I drive.. About how long do I have before it completely shuts down. I have two trips to make before I can get it to mechanic.. Please help
Matthew
Travis,
Was looking at buying a 03 Lincoln LS V8 and the car will only get to 5-10MPH. Do you know what could be causing this?
Thanks
Branda
I have a 2003 lincoln ls v6 treat her good only other owner my mother recently it started going into fail safe mode upon rapid acceleration and while trying to pass other vehicles the gas completley goes out im able to pull over and restart it fine the wrench light comes on when this happens and eventually the engine light the parking brake light has been going off for a year or so brand new cpils put in by ford less than a year ago due to misfires and now this so a mechanic put in a new therottle body after it showed the code for bad throttle body reset it and still goes into fail safe mode what is going on any suggestions??
Tewuana Pounds
I have a 2005 Lincoln ls and just recently started having the similar problem. It first started a month ago. I was driving on a service rd at 40 mph and suddenly the “wrench” icon popped up on my dashboard and my car started to reduce in speed. Based upon the car’s manual “limp home” state. I was not able to accelerate normally but once I turned off and back on the engine everything operated just fine. It took about a month for the problem to reocurr and now its frequently. I took it to the shop they replaced the throttle body actuator and throttle position sensor two days ago which did not fix issue. Now they are saying it’s the pedal sensor which they advised me is no longer made and can only get at a dealer. They found a dealer that has the part but will take 5 days to get it. Hopefully this will fix my problem. So far I’ve spent $425
Robert . B
Good morning Travis
Have a 2003 Lincoln LS that has messages illuminating my dash like it was December 25th. Etc , parking brake service , abs, no odometer readout , speedo no longer working , all came on in a rotating display all of a sudden on this summers morning.
The only correlation I could find is that during an oil change the previous evening the electronic parking brake was engaged and then dis engaged after procedure had been completed. The coil packs ( all 8 ) were replaced approx 1 year prior as well as all 8 plugs as three were found to be bad. The replacements were not oem. At that time replaced the cats as well as was told by dealer this was needed.
Car ran spectacular until it didn’t which brings me to correspondence with you. Have taken to my regular mechanic who I trust and he could not find problem as he stated lost communication. Took it to large local ford Lincoln dealer and after three hours time they also said they could not find problem. They stated needed more time to diagnose at 108 dollars an hour. It’s my sons car and he could ill afford this rate and I concurred that after three hours perhaps best to move on. So now the car sits.
Any direction to look would be helpful. Gaskets were never replaced when replacement coils and plugs were done one year ago. Thank you my friend.
TONY
02 LINCOLN LSE PISTON 1 MISFIRE CODE… CHECKED PLUG, COIL, AND WIRING…ALL ARE GOOD… ONLY MISFIRES AFTER IT HAS COME UP TO TEMPERATURE. HELP PLEASE????
steven
I have a Lincoln LS 2003 model I replace the electric throttle body the gas pedal the throttle sensor and still won’t do nothing the run all day but won’t go nowhere
Rudy
Quick question unrelated. I have a 2005 lincoln ls v6 that was T-boned. I have a 2003 lincoln ls v8 with broken motor. Can i swap the v6 over to the v8 chassis. Using all parts and wiring from the v6? Thanks for any information.
Rudy
ARTPERERA
I have a 2000 Lincoln LS 3.9. One morning I started the engine and it did not idle right. I took the coil covers off to check which cylinder
was not firing. Tested 1 -4 and they were fine, meaning that when I disconnected the connector from the coil, the engine rpm got worse.
Then I tested 5-8 (right side of the engine) and as I removed the connectors from cylinder 5-8, there was no change in the RPM. I then removed
all the coil connectors from cylinder 5-8 and again, there was not change in RPM. How is it possible for all 4 cylinders to not fire all at once
over night. Next I ordered new coils from Autopartswarehouse.com and replaced them all. I also tested all the sparkplugs and even though they
were still good, I bought new ones to replace them.
I reconnected everything back and restarted the engine. Problem stayed the same. No CEL light or codes, and the REV limiter is set to 3000RPM.
Aarg. It can’t be this difficult to resolve this.
scott harris
i have a 2003 lincoln ls,v6 and i can’t figure out whats going on with it.
when i first start the car and take off in the morning with it, it runs like a champ.until it warms up, then it loses a bit of power upon accelerating,and sounds very throttlie,almost as if it had an old school 4 barrel carb on it.(that kind of sound)
I’ve replaced the fuel filter and discovered that someone had put a piece of heater hose where the plastic vacuum tube goes leading back to the pcv. I’ve replaced that as well.
it also seems to be shifting into overdrive prematurely,and doesn’t seem to stay in the right gear for the speed I’m going.
its not showing and check engine lights or anything,
but upon reading your post, i take it that the cop system fails regularly on these?
and would a dirty throttle body or worn tps cause these symptoms?
Any input as to where to start looking would be greatly appreciated!!!!
steve mazak
I have an 2003 LS v8 the problem is shutting down after warm up. The colder outside the longer it run, then the restarts get shorter running time.The engine run very sought at low or high rpms. The only sensor that I have not change out are camshaft positions sensors, ignition transformer capacitors, knock sensor and the cylinder head temp sensors all the others sensors had been change with an new battery and O2s sensors plus a new gas filterer and gas cap(ford) – because the Check Gas Cap Light come on when the engine shut down with the Check Engine Light. The CPU at first was not showing any codes, so I unplug some sensors and code came in, send the CPU out to be tested and repaired.Cleared the code and started fresh show codes of U1262,B2900 and C1805 clear the CPU with the negative post off and jumper wire from position to negative wire. Start the car up still having the problem no codes tested with other sensors, showing up on my scanner and hope you can help me on this ???
Thanks Steve Mazak
stxman1998@yahoo.com
561-715-2280
DannyluG
Существует такая услуга – добровольное медицинское обслуживание .
Она предполагает, что пациент платит небольшую сумму за абонемент и ходит на прием целый год бесплатно.
Однако опросы показали, что лишь 3% жителей города знают о такой программе.
Почему?
Да потому что клиникам выгоднее сдирать с людей деньги за каждое посещение.
А если честный врач попытается посоветовать добровольное медицинское обслуживание клиенту – это сулит ему увольнением.
Эта информация уже спровоцировала кучу возмущений, после того как информацию об этом рассекретил один возмущенный врач.
Его уволили , после того, как он предложил ДМО постоянному клиенту.
Самое страшное, что официальные положения по ДМО находились в открытом доступе, просто натыкались на эту информацию только случайные люди.
Как отстоять свои права?
О правилах оказания услуги и обязанностях частных клиник можно узнать, просто вбив в Яндекс фразу: “добровольное медицинское обслуживание”.
И именно обслуживание, а не страхование.
34j5c6h86
Johnson
I just purchased (5 days ago) a 2003 Lincoln LS V8 3.9 It was skipping a bit but I assumed it just needed the plugs changed.
I also made the mistake of washing the motor.(Which now I know wasnt smart). then I was driving it not a mile up the street and the ETC “Safe Mode” came on and the car will not stay idle nor can I accelarate and Im getting 3 codes. P2104, P2111, P2135. I have changed the plugs but not sure what else to try. any help would be appreciated. Thanks
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Frank Russo
I have a 2005 lincoln ls, it has the 3.0 6 cylinder, it was throwing the same codes plus about 8 more, all refering to the throttle body. It will start up with a high idle then slowly go down to about 800 rpms, if i rec it up it will not rev past 3000 rpms, when i go for a test drive it takes for ever to get it up to 40 mph, it does have a rough idle at first, then mellos out. I was thinking it was either coils or a sensor in the
transmission
KAYSWELL
Shop sunglasses online at http://www.kayswell.com
Wilfred Housand
more content please
Richard York
What I believe was going on was that the coil would only fail under a very high load, and when it did, the voltage spike was always large enough to knock the PCM out.